latest infos

[gaurav311]

nokia

another 9xxx before year is out, clamshell but different to 9500
at least 2 8xxx models, one of which is 8920 and another 8220
7620 as stated earlier,
3 6xxx models, 1 is a chunkier 8220 for business, and the other is an update to 6230 for wcdma, along with 6850
the info on 3xxx and 5xxx models is less clear, afaik at least 1 of each have similar capability to 8xxx models as well but be much bulkier, and the rest will be series 45 updates to existing lines such as 31x0 (which has similar spec to 6230 internally). also currently experiminting with 4-series touchwheel designs aimed at teenage market.

some of these i did mention earlier but nokia held all of them back, current plans still show they will all come this year however.

se

p1000 & k900 shown before year end (I expect k900 (3g + gsm)will come after s700 properly released to not screw up sales). z700 clamshell cancelled.

moto

all stuff already announced

samsung i have less clear info on, I think all stuff already shown now though, maybe slight modifications will be done for world markets.

[draak 1]

gaurav311,is there also new TSerie's and Z Serie's??

Greetings from Draak

[gaurav311]

T may be continued as cheap phone line, i am not sure. Z I would think they will keep for 3G future phones, I can think of at least 1 (not Z1020!).

[draak 1]

I have another question,How is the relation ship between Ericsson and Sony??

So the T Serie's may be continued as a cheap phone,but what about the Hich end line fron SE?

And what about the new P Seriie's??

PS I'm glad that you share your info about SE and Nokia phone for that i'm thankfull. :cool:

I have more intrest in SE than Nokia and what is you intrest? Nokia or SE :)


Gaurav311 mabey you can share SE info to http://www.esato.com/ A special SE members site :D

[bu_7assooon]

another 9xxx? do you know any specs? will it use series90 or series80?

[gaurav311]

cant say anything. nokia is developing a seperate enterprise line that won't be marketed in same way as their usual phones, of which 9500 was the first. there will be more than just 9500, and 3g is being taken into account with future planning heavily.

i think nokia still has the edge in overall phone hardware + software design. SE is making impressive hardware but software needs to become more tight.

SE relationship is great afaik.

[aziz]

nokia will release 2 more clamshell one 6xxx & 3xxx

regarding se
p1000 october showen
relesed november or maximum desmber
k900 name not 100% corect may change & it's not 3g it's edeg
z700 not cancelled it may be renamed that's all it well be showen with the z300 & 2 more phones before summer
one more new index from se in may or june

[jack087]

so are those 2 phones the successor of the T310 and the T100 and is this new index for rugged phones ? hope those are not too many questions :D

[bu_7assooon]

wow..new index..SE is really shaking things up...q4 2004 will be a hell of a good time...cant wait!

[gaurav311]

aziz i haven't heard of any nokia clamshells? 7200 was an experiment and technically didn't pan out as well as expected.

K900 is a 3g model, might be called K1000 (the new SE focus on handsets is that 1xxx and up = 3G) but it will be a K-series and 3G. It might not be announced this year. From info I have the T900 eldar is talking about will be the last GSM in high end and after that T releases will be 3G as well (T1000 already in planning).
Z300 you are correct, but I do not know of any other models for Z other than 3G ones later on Z1030 etc.
Above info also may imply that P1000 will NOT be P1000 but P950 or something, as it lacks the 3G to make it a 1xxx.

And I have further clarification on the nokia wcdma 8xxx models (and lower models) screen - it will be similar to the 128x160s used on E700 *but slightly larger* than that, definately less than series 60 that I know. I have played with the menus and they are nothing like anything out now - I think nokia might call this Series 50 or series45+ or something! There will be a bigger 7660 (they are thinking of moving to 86xx line, not decided yet) series "video-phone" with more powerful recording features and series 60 running on it later. This is different to the other 8xxx models I mention.

[petterekman]

Wow, gaurav311, that's some exciting info! Thanks! Always interesting to see what the future holds!

[Delphi]

gaurav311 Nokia is planning to launch 4 3G handsets in the fourth quarter. You have stated that their will be an 8 series and a new version of the 7600 with video to video capability. What esle do you think they will launch in 3G ?

I believe that are also developing a 3G clam for launch in late 2004 plus a more mass market 3G handset which will be cheaper than any of the other models being talked about.

When you talk about the new UI on the 8 series is it similar to the UI they are using on the new music phone with the iPod like dial ?

With regards to the SE T900 if this is in fact a smartphone as suggested on other forums that it will not ship in 2004 if it is using the new Symbian version 8 with IUQ 3.0 as there is no way they can do the work in time after the software is released.

Agree with you on the next version of the P900 it will not be called the P1000 as you correctly point out no 3G radio - in fact it is unlikely you will see a 3G version of the P900 in 2005 either.

[gaurav311]

yes, 4-5 wcdma to begin with plus sprinkling of more edge handsets. last time i spoke with nokia they were not really happy with their clamshell 3g developments, i don't think they will actually launch that model...maybe just to make sure...that one is HUGE though :) Have you seen the one that had keypad outside when it closes?
last time i checked there will be 2 slightly different (but in same series) 3g cheaper nokias...maybe one will come a bit later than other...they are almost same though, one just has cooler outside and more addons and things.
they are also making slight modifications to 8100/8220 - i can now almost say for certain it will be called *8300* not 8220 and the 8910i successor the *89xx* - currently title is 8900 but they can change it last stage to make it look better than 8910i name. the name of the 6 series i mention now has also been finalised to 6300. All of these are the 3G line. I'm not sure if they will also launch the 7300, it feels clunky and i have advised against it.
most of these are quite small compared to current 3g still...but i remember them being quite heavy, even the 8 series (although that one is small). The numbers are being given to me someone not involved in direct development, and are tentative as usual, but the specs should be accurate (I've held some of these, totally fresh new designs, everyone will love them, nothing like silly 7600 experiment!).
The TFT i am being told is a active matrix 163x132?! Or maybe I should say 132x163 ;) They might use more complex ones for more expensive 8xxx models (i can't remember exact resolution of the one i played with) but the cheaper looking one i held was definitely this resolution. the guy said that 3g video streams at a certain resolution and having more screen space is not worth it on most of their new 3g models.

[gaurav311]

T900 should actually just be another E100 based phone, priced above K700 but below S700. Eldar seems to indicate that it will be out this year, but I am not too sure..maybe announced later this year, but no way they can release it until 2005! It does have memory stick pro duo, and the K700 music player, which is quite a strong combination..I don't know...I think it will be out really late, sort of like T630 came after T610, there will be T900 after K700 - i.e. despite market they are still like successor phones. SE should have 1-2 Z1xxx and another K series for 3G to show before xmas also. I'm quite amazed there won't actually be any 3G smartphones for a long while (7610 is kind of, but more of a fashion phone).

[gaurav311]

there is a nokia new 1x00 also, its very small and nice, i don't think phones can get any smaller in that range.

[draak 1]

Gaurav.

This is deep sad that SonyEricsson to late with new models will come, this is real sad.

If I read about Nokia, then will Nokia further far than SonyEricsson purely because they before come with new models, that possible more technolochy has then SonyEricsson models. And that does me pain as faithful SonyEricsson user. :(

it's about time that Sony and Ericsson more must work together.

[kristof.vanriet]

so you think we will see this year:
1x00 a new basic phone, Very small
3xxx not sure
a youth phone with touchweel design
5xxx not sure
6xxx 3 new devices a 6300, an updated 6230 with WCDMA, a new 6850 (full open keypath)
7660 (or 86xx) a series 80 device video-phone
7620 (update 7600?)
8300
89xx (succesor 8910i)
9xxx new clamshell one

a update on the series40 might become series 50
bigger screens with res 163x132

that's a lot to come, nice...

[bu_7assooon]

I bet that SE has lots more up their sleves, In my opinion I think SE might release a t1xx and z300 and t2xx this year, and I guess they will introduce the successor of p900 and successor of t610...t900 and maybe z700 somewhere in sept and it might be relesed in jan 2005.
Aslo I hope if SE wants to release a k900 3g phone...to make it gsm too so that people without access to 3g can use them.
As for nokia, If they release 4-5 3g phones will they work with gsm? like the 7600 becasue it hard to focus in 3g alone as 3g is still not in many countries.

[Delphi]

kristof.vanriet

Good summary. To add in a couple of more blanks Nokia has also been showing round a mid tier camera phone for second half of the year and a low cost entry level camera phone (bar type) which I would assume will be a low tier 3 series or maybe a 2 series.


gaurav311

163 x 132 is a strange display size. Not aware of any display vendors offering this size. Do you have any details on why they have selected this size ?

[traktori]

Originally posted by bu_7assooon
I bet that SE has lots more up their sleves, In my opinion I think SE might release a t1xx and z300 and t2xx this year, and I guess they will introduce the successor of p900 and successor of t610...t900 and maybe z700 somewhere in sept and it might be relesed in jan 2005.
Aslo I hope if SE wants to release a k900 3g phone...to make it gsm too so that people without access to 3g can use them.
As for nokia, If they release 4-5 3g phones will they work with gsm? like the 7600 becasue it hard to focus in 3g alone as 3g is still not in many countries.

Like today I would say future 3G-phones will have GSM for very long time. 3G (WCDMA) isn't going to cover every area for a very long time, if ever, and for this reason there is support for 1 or more GSM frequencies for at least 2-3 years from now on in every 3G phones. So don't worry!

[gaurav311]

yeah trak all new nokias are gsm-wcdma, although they are targetting gsm-edge and wcdma as different segments still. you will see lots of phones in 3g that borrow from a similar gsm. lots of parallels in designs, thats why info on new 8xxx phones is confusing for me at moment. I have seen edge 128x128 pixel 8xxx's that was not a rumour either, so they might launch that one too...but the wcdma ones and music-ring one are definate world wide releases

[gaurav311]

kristof.vanriet
there's more than that even, but thats most interesting ones...most should make it to market in the end. mid range cam one is 3220 i would imagine, because 3350 is their value video one.

apparently 3g vid is very low res and isnt needing high resolutions - to fit series-60 type display 7610 is pretty much as small as it can get and that one costs a lot. some higher end will use better screens, but their mainstream 3g target is that one i mention, i am quite certain. the music ring phone will use revised interface too. the new storage solution for that phone is interesting, differently set up to anything else out now. also browsing names on that phone is *much* better than anything else ive used, incredibly fast, im surprised competition hasn't picked it up - buttons are nothing compared to this! probably single biggest improvement in intefaces ive seen in years (apple still hasnt actually patented this i heard).

[gaurav311]

also remember that about half of these new nokias (including ones i didnt mention) still use the passive slow crap colour screen, mostly the value ones...i guess its an improvement from black and white for the 1/2 series...although maybe not :) those are gsm anyway. the 3g ones, every single one tft, minimum res. 132x163 and dual cam. the cameras are in same corner (both send and receive) for most models, both vga. 7610 is megapixel, but don't expect toooo much from the rest :)

[bu_7assooon]

traktori
I guess I can see that the nokia 3g phones gona be gsm too.
But what I'm confused about is SE future phones, I mean the z1010 is only 3g so will all the others be only 3g?

[orange]

Nokia stated last week that they are going to introduce 40 new phones during this year. So it's pretty easy to throw some model numbers to the air and atleast some of those will match...

[gaurav311]

z1010 is gsm too actually i think.
the problem with putting both in is that it makes the phone quite heavy (as you will see with some of the new nokias - small but heavy)
orange
they won't be releasing 40, that's just press hype, realistically its about 12 new models, with lots of regional variations of the same thing.
it would be incredibly stupid for them to release 40 different phones in a year. they've cut back immensely on R&D since 7210, and the only real new thing in any of their phones will be the touch wheel thing and nice designs. Everything else is already out there, just a bit bigger.

[traktori]

Originally posted by bu_7assooon
traktori
I guess I can see that the nokia 3g phones gona be gsm too.
But what I'm confused about is SE future phones, I mean the z1010 is only 3g so will all the others be only 3g?

No, Z1010 has also dual-band 900/1800 GSM. And so will every mobile phones from every company (in GSM-world) for 2-3 coming years at least.

[orange]

Originally posted by gaurav311

orange
they won't be releasing 40, that's just press hype, realistically its about 12 new models, with lots of regional variations of the same thing.
it would be incredibly stupid for them to release 40 different phones in a year. they've cut back immensely on R&D since 7210, and the only real new thing in any of their phones will be the touch wheel thing and nice designs. Everything else is already out there, just a bit bigger.
Well, they launched about 40 phones last year. Why wouldn't they do the same this year??

[Rogger]

orange
In fact they already said they will release around 40 new phones this year too.

[zanoman]

Originally posted by orange
Well, they launched about 40 phones last year. Why wouldn't they do the same this year??

Look at his post Orange.. They will release about 12 complete new models, with a lot of regional variations. Just look at the Nokia 6610, 7210, 7210i and 7250 last year... 4 releases but basically 1 NEW phone with some minor changes. So it they will release 12 NEW models this year, and have 3-4 models with minor differences, that will total it up to about 40 models this year


Eric

[gaurav311]

not even that...most of the 12 or so phones will be quite same...basically just 2 types of new menu system not seen before, and all models will be based on that. if you check closely 7700 menus I think they borrow a lot from that actually (for one of the new menus)

orange, nokia didn't release 40 distinct models last year, where did you get that figure, as i said it's marketing hype. I am not dissing nokia here, just trying to clarify that it's not actually 40 totally different new models. in fact i think they will totally dominate market with these models...if you thought motorola was releasing lots of new innovative handsets, you haven't seen anything yet..moto exhausted their list...Siemens and SE instead have their mainline 3G in secret at the moment so you will see stuff there too.

To correct earlier error, the new business nokia is a 6500 - basically a 8300 but fatter and plain (i called this 6510 successor earlier).

[Delphi]

Nokia are master at platforming hence why they have made so much money in the past 5 years. However this approach may not be good enough in the future if their profit warning from yesterday is anything to go by.

Interesting to see Nokia being so aggressive on 3G as the next generation will really be their first true 3G handsets (video calling). Given that everyone who has launched this feature so far has been very late with their handsets I will be surprised if Nokia does ship all the models it has committed to operators.


gaurav311 don't think we have seen all the Motorola 3G products yet. keep watching for later in the year but they have some things still to be announced.

Siemens is interesting for the same reason as Nokia. Not yet proven they can do a real 3G handset as they are still using Motorola as an OEM and I hear looking to OEM the next generation as well.

SonyEricsson should release some interesting handsets provided they can hit their launch dates they should be very competitive and very nicely designed as well.

Of course we should also talk about LG as they have another 4 handsets coming for 3G which are all small, feature rich and attractive to look at.

[draak 1]

Delphi wrote "Nokia are master at platforming hence why they have made so much money in the past 5 years"

I am disagree, Ericsson make the best platforms always did.
Nokia has success because of her name and with their so-called easy menu.

[Delphi]

draak 1 My comment was not about who makes the best platform but rather how the platform is used.

Nokia typically has a 70% plus level of reuse between its entry level phones (3 Series ) and its high tier phones (7/8 series). Take series 40 and you see the same handsets with minor changes appearing all over the portfolio but the 7/8 series models typically generate 10 - 15 times the level of profit of a 3 series product. For example the bill of materials for the 3100 is about $5 different to that of a 7200, 6100, 6600 and likewise the 3200 bill of materials is very close to the 6220, 7250 etc but the prices they charge are very different.

I don't believe any other company to date has been able to achieve what Nokia has achieved in terms of inventory management and number of models based off a single platform.

SonyEricsson has traditionally used different platform for the 100, 200, 300 and 600 (I know this is changing soon) including the use of OEMs.

Siemens has far to many OEMs to be able to effectively platform - the CX65, S65, M65 is its first real effort.

Motorola - traditionally never understood the word platform. The new triplets/C650/C380/V180/V220/V80/E398 all seem to be based on the same platfrom so it looks like they are about to start matching Nokia in this area.

Japan - well platforming is something new to them.

Samsung - Not bad but has been benchmarking Nokia.

[orange]

Originally posted by gaurav311
not even that...most of the 12 or so phones will be quite same...basically just 2 types of new menu system not seen before, and all models will be based on that. if you check closely 7700 menus I think they borrow a lot from that actually (for one of the new menus)
So, basicly according to you, new phone = new menu?

Originally posted by gaurav311
orange, nokia didn't release 40 distinct models last year, where did you get that figure, as i said it's marketing hype. I am not dissing nokia here, just trying to clarify that it's not actually 40 totally different new models. in fact i think they will totally dominate market with these models...if you thought motorola was releasing lots of new innovative handsets, you haven't seen anything yet..moto exhausted their list...Siemens and SE instead have their mainline 3G in secret at the moment so you will see stuff there too.

You can easily find the number of launched models from the last years press releases. They released about 40 phones with different model numbers...1100, 2220, 2260, 2270, 2275, 2280, 2285, 2300, 3100, 3105, 3108, 3200, 3300, 3520, 3560, 3586i, 3588i, 3589i, 3590, 6585, 6010, 6560... and the list goes on.

Basicly according to your theory, new platform should be launched to be able to lauch new phones because phones based to the existing platforms aren't really new since there's already phones based on that platform.

There's only two Nokia phones which use exactly the same sw and hw excluding covers, 6610 and 7210. All the others differ somehow in sw or hw wise.

[gaurav311]

well you know what i meant
out of the list you gave only a subset will come to each given market

.1100, 2220, 2260, 2270, 2275, 2280, 2285, 2300, 3100, 3105, 3108, 3200, 3300, 3520, 3560, 3586i, 3588i, 3589i, 3590, 6585, 6010, 6560...

As a european, I know only of 1100, 2300, 3100, 3200, 3300 out of those....as an american I would know some and not the others, and basically they would be minor variations on each other. Nokia only has a few streams of *original* development, not 40, and you know that. A distinct phone would be like a 7210 is to a 6100. I did not say new menu is needed for that.

[gaurav311]

Delphi
bill of materials for 8/7xxx aren't much higher, but those do have more R&D invested in them, for example nokia had 25 designers working 2 years for 7210 base design. But yes they make a massive killing on 8-7 series anyway :)

[orange]

Originally posted by gaurav311
As a european, I know only of 1100, 2300, 3100, 3200, 3300 out of those

Nokia do sell phones also in other continents. You saying those shouldn't be counted??
Originally posted by gaurav311
Nokia only has a few streams of *original* development, not 40, and you know that. A distinct phone would be like a 7210 is to a 6100. I did not say new menu is needed for that.
We all know that Nokia has 4 base platforms in use at the moment. Of course they are releasing several phones from each platform and because it's platform, basic features are the same. As I said earlier, 40 new phones with different model numbers. You can of course count it in your way and somebody else can count in his/her way. Nokia counts the number of the phones with different model numbers.

[deuxani]

I think gaurav means that the phones for the other continents are the same phones, only with a different model number.

I don't understand why people are "atacking" gaurav these days, he's just giving info/rumors. Would ya'll be happy if he stopped giving this info/rumors?

[rraz9228]

I agree! actually, gaurav is making this rumor section fun and interesting.

[Memzee]

gaurav311

You're always so sure of yourself! Where do you get this information from? What makes you so special that you seem to think you know more than everyone else?

Just look at this thread: http://www.mobile-review.com/forum2/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6853

You were so sure that there was gonna be a T650 and a T710 (!) and now you're saying that there's no such thing. That thread was from before CeBit2004, and there was no mention of the K700, S700, or Z500!

Don't take this in an offensive way, I'm just curious.

[jack087]

names can change
and i guess that he tells us what he hears, its impossible that everything is 100% correct and if you read through it (carryfully) you will see that he just told us about K700 and S700 only without the names and maybe with some bits that changed

[gaurav311]

yeah the names can change, it takes no time to do that (marketing can change it last minute). for sony it decision to cut their t series into a t and k series (even though its same platform). a lot of the info doesn't come clearly to me either, and i explain it best way i can. s700 was their new one, and t710 with 220x178 screen became k700. the other one they held back, it was a value-t650, a t630 with speakerphone and small changes. they didnt show it. if they did then my t650 t710 (k700) names would fit along with my new z-series and 1 new line description.

i did tell you that there was no memory stick. i never mentioned T900 (eldar's t650) because it is so far away. just name confusion with sony's (SE decided on k700i naming very last minute). descriptions should be right though. the nokia data i get is more accurate, sony ones i dont get to hold them so i can only pass on what i know. new nokias regardless of names, a lot of the data will fit (like my description of hardware, screens, interfaces) because i have held some of them already and know for definite. whether they choose 8220 or 8300 is more difficult to say though, as i said this info doesn't come 100% clear to me, maybe 8220 and 8300 are 2 seperate new phones, i don't know. i have held a premium line proto with 128x128 screen, and then another with bigger screen in same line, but i can't say if that means they are cancelling the 128x128 one. i just say what i hear from sources and try putting in context. best to wait and see.

[kristof.vanriet]

Memzee
be glad that there are people like gaurav311, who giving us information what to expect in near future. He is the one that makes this part of this forum (the rumors) very intresting...

in name of all the rumor fans, Thanx for sharing this info

[rraz9228]

and remember, this is a rumor section. Where did you find a rumor that is 100% accurate. That is why its called a rumor in the first place. If its 100% accurate, its going to be called a "fact" not a rumor anymore. :cool:

[Delphi]

Memzee
Be reasonable. Can you name one product that has kept the same name all the way through its product development cycle. Most vendors have a) multiple code names, b) complex naming schemes that are breaking down as they expand their portfolios c) too many people involved in actually deciding on the commercial product name.

I like gaurav311 often get to see many new products before they are announced it is a rare occassion when a product gets to market with the same same that is first used behind closed doors.

Also consider that some vendors use different market names with different network operators (in fact this is to try and control rumours :-( )so it is possible for people to be talking about the same product but using different names.

[draak 1]

Don't forget Azis he has info as well :D

To Gaurav and Azis.

You two are great and for that :beer:

Keep the info running :D

[-The Andyman-]

yeh well done gaurav311 and aziz 4 providing us with good info

[mindhacker]

The new business 6500 cant be 6500 because 6500 exists.... nice info..

[kristof.vanriet]

mindhacker, names of a phone can always change... it's just a number to give you a idea about...

[Connect]

Hello all, this is my first post. Hey gaurav, when will Nokia announce any new 3XXX series 40 phones (for youngsters)? And what can you tell me about them ? Will they be bigger in size than 3100 and 3200 ? Will the design be classic? What about the features (compared to 3100 and 3200)? And what is this "wheel" i keep reading of ? I hope you (or anyone who can) will answer my questions. :D Thanks.

[gaurav311]

a lot of new 3 series are basic rehashes of current ones (3100 etc), nothing especially new, on GSM ones anyway, they still don't use large LCD TFT on them yet! But they are nicer design-wise. Size similar to 3100, smaller than 3200, basically best of both, cameras on every new phone except 1 and 2 series. Wheel thing is major feature on some pilot phones to come a bit later, unable to confirm exact functionality for various reasons, but it speeds up menus very much, and some other new button ideas will be shown (some you have already seen in charlie like the dual power-like buttons, for setting the mode (outdoor, silent, etc) faster).

update: 3220 and 3230 (one of which already shown now) are decided names for these successors. another 3 series one will come a bit later.

[Connect]

Thank you very much for the informations. I'd be happy if the design would be like the Nokia 3100. When will the new phones be revealed officially and when will they be out?